Ren Zhengfei: Huawei will become increasingly difficult and prosperous
On the evening of September 21st, the full text of a conversation between Liu Yadong, Dean of the School of Journalism and Communication at Nankai University and former editor in chief of Science and Technology Daily, and Ren Zhengfei, founder of Huawei, was recently exposed in a coffee shop in Shenzhen on July 7th this year.
Ren Zhengfei: Huawei will become increasingly difficult and prosperous
Ren Zhengfei claimed that he never said 'overthrow the United States' information map
During this conversation, Ren Zhengfei mainly expressed the following important viewpoints:
1、 Faced with sanctions and suppression from the United States, Huawei will become increasingly difficult, but it will also become increasingly prosperous.
2、 To do a good job in education, it is necessary to differentiate, as geniuses are born among young people. Primary and secondary schools have gone step by step, homogenizing education, and burying genius. Don't overemphasize the 'starting line' and avoid homogenization.
3、 To solve educational problems, one must first overcome network barriers. Can China further improve the educational conditions of primary and secondary schools? Using National People's Congress Affiliated High School, Tsinghua Affiliated High School, and Shanghai's good middle schools as platforms, and using all of China's good schools as platforms to open courses online.
4、 We still need to learn from the advanced culture of the United States, and we have never said 'overthrow the United States'. Huawei is also conducting some basic research. Basic research cannot be separated from basic education. Basic education is the responsibility of the country, and without good basic education, top talents cannot be cultivated.
5、 Our country should value those who cannot directly create value. People who cannot directly create value should also live a decent life. Without a decent life, no one will innovate, so we can only follow the United States and run. This country will never lead the world.
6、 Talent cultivation should implement a dual track system. Everyone has the ability to self-study, but they also need to receive a good education. My regret is that I haven't attended a prestigious university or received a PhD, and I envy the children who attend Tsinghua and Peking University. Sometimes I also listen to classes online. If I could have listened to their classes when I was young, how much progress would I have made? Unfortunately, I didn't have such a chance.
The following is the full text of the conversation:
Liu Yadong: First of all, please let Mr. Ren talk about Huawei's basic research. Huawei has thousands of scientists and experts... whether engaged in basic research or cutting-edge exploration, is their research work driven by interest or demand?
Ren Zhengfei: Does Dean Liu know about the Rafael nozzle? It is an important phenomenon in aerodynamics, and a rocket engine is like a Lafarre nozzle. The compressible fluid is squeezed by the Lafarre nozzle, resulting in a larger expansion and faster velocity of the ejected gas.
Our research and development also utilizes this principle. The boundary has been determined, and as long as employees are willing to play a role within this boundary, their potential can be unleashed, and energy will also erupt under certain circumstances. The boundaries of scientific scope are relatively broad, and a research and development team of over 100000 people can always find opportunities for them to play a role. At this point, there is self driving space for interest at the boundaries.
After the theory is confirmed, entering the product stage, one cannot flip around like Sun Wukong. So, on the product side, there should be an orderly team building, and the goal of this team building is to quickly lead the world, which will enter the expansion stage of the Rafael nozzle. So, we have boundaries, not entirely interest driven, but interest is also encouraged and allowed.
In fact, universities also have boundaries, but their boundaries are wider. We collaborate with universities, where they can research further things, publish their own papers, win awards, and have the opportunity to be promoted as professors and academicians. This has nothing to do with us, we don't need to put our names on it. We may also have a team to help him, and this team does not need to be signed. Why? You can only have the same name and profit. Why compete for fame with teachers when we have all the benefits? So, young professors in universities are very willing to cooperate with us.
We used to mainly cooperate with universities in Western countries, but considering that they are constantly shrinking their scope of cooperation, we have strengthened our cooperation with Chinese universities.
It is probably such a structure that the "bell mouth" absorbs cosmic energy. After theoretical research, mature research results, and personnel quickly expand at the product end through the Rafael nozzle, quickly completing world-class products. Firstly, people have been transformed through this bell mouth, and with the spray of the Lafarre nozzle, their personality and characteristics have changed; Secondly, excellent talents have a stage to showcase their talents. In this process, it is a flipping and jumping type, which is beneficial for outstanding talents to stand out.
Liu Yadong: Does Huawei have any requirements for the person at the top of the Rafael nozzle?
Ren Zhengfei: The previous investment of over 23 billion yuan, including cooperation with universities and basic research, we never consider returns, and only have assessment requirements when it comes to the product line below.
You can see the news tonight (July 7th) that our Pangu Large Model has been released, which is a large model with hundreds of billions of parameters. Our current AI cluster supports 16000 cards, and in the future, a super node cluster can manage hundreds of thousands of cards. An AI cluster supercomputing system manages so many boards, supports ultra fast interconnection, highly efficient liquid cooling, and instantaneous explosive power supply, achieving high system availability. We are not inferior to the United States in these aspects.
If our product is not advanced enough, it will not be sold. I can't sell at a high price, nor can I support the team.
Liu Yadong: Huawei has developed many software, including management software ERP, design software EDA, Hongmeng, and Euler operating systems. Software development is a dynamic process that requires iterative updates and an industrial ecosystem, which is definitely not something that Huawei alone can establish. It requires many companies to work together. What role does Huawei play in this?
Ren Zhengfei: Huawei will become increasingly difficult and prosperous
Ren Zhengfei Talks about Software Development as a Dynamic Process Data Graph
Ren Zhengfei: Actually, developing tool software is because we need to use it to design products. For example, if our goal is to build cars, we must have screwdrivers and wrenches. But without a screwdriver and wrench, cars cannot be built. Screwdrivers and wrenches are not our purpose. So, we will take various domestic manufacturers to make "screwdrivers" and "wrenches". Our people will gradually retreat, and these tools and software are theirs. But their things will grow on our clouds, which is cloudification. In this way, the domestic electronic industry can design independently. We have publicly released more than 20 tool software to the society, and we have already used many internally. When the shortcomings are no longer visible, these tools and software will be made public to society. At that time, the company we were originally developing with will take over. There are still 58 tool software being validated.
Hongmeng and Euler have commercial goals, which are to drag our cloud forward and strengthen the cloud platform base. The cloud platform provides a rich range of components and services, which we call "Black Land". If we develop it on top of it, we will become SaaS, which is a social thing. We still make computing power base platforms, and we also make computing power base platforms for artificial intelligence.
Liu Yadong: Good products are used, especially software. The cultivation of the software industry ecosystem is a long-term process. Does this mean that Huawei, as a leading enterprise, needs to invest heavily?
Ren Zhengfei: Although Euler and Hongmeng (code) have donated, we still invest tens of thousands of people and billions of funds every year to do this. We have also united many domestic companies to do ERP together, and they can take everything away and grow on our cloud. In the future, it will be open and capable companies can do it. Growing on the cloud is just an ecosystem!
Liu Yadong: How is the ecological construction of the Hongmeng operating system progressing now?
Ren Zhengfei: Currently, there are more than 30 operating systems in China built on Hongmeng open-source, covering industry terminals, mobile tablets, and home terminals. In total, there are approximately 600 million users, ranking third in the world. Hongmeng has just upgraded to 4.0, and after the upgrade, external players will also follow suit. There is an open source community outside, not Huawei alone. We are doing the base and kernel. We are doing 'black soil', and the 'corn', 'soybean', or 'sorghum' on it are all grown by our partners.
Ren Zhengfei: Huawei will become increasingly difficult and prosperous
More than 30 domestic operating systems built on Hongmeng open-source
Liu Yadong: Faced with sanctions and suppression from the United States, Huawei has achieved many domestic substitution of technology and products. What development direction will Huawei choose in the face of increasingly severe external environment?
Ren Zhengfei: Huawei will become increasingly difficult, but Huawei will also become more prosperous.
If China establishes its own standard system in the future, then this standard system will definitely be better than the United States. The standards in the United States have been established since the 1970s and have been in place for over 50 years. Their clothes are patched up and patched up everywhere. Why do we still follow the same standard when we have been making new clothes in recent years? We directly set better standards than the United States. Except for China, it is used all over the world.
Liu Yadong: Education is the foundation of a nation's destiny and the most important support for us to catch up with and surpass the world's advanced levels in science and technology. In your opinion, how can we quickly promote China's education industry?
Ren Zhengfei: Why has the West led us in the past few hundred years? The West invented trains and ships, and they walked fast. We drove the carriage, which was still made of wood wheels and had no bearings, so we were three hundred to five hundred years behind the West. Now, we are leading the West in some fields of informatization. We are sitting on the 'high-speed rail', and if they still sit on the 'carriage', they will fall behind. The progress of the past and the progress of tomorrow are all compared to speed.
In the long run, the development of the country still needs to address the issue of education. To solve educational problems, one must first overcome network barriers. Can the national telecommunications network further cede profits like high-speed rail? Why is high-speed rail losing money? Because the ticket price was set too low. Our high-speed rail does not make money, but it has good social benefits. High speed rail embodies serving the people, not the RMB. The result of not raising prices is better social benefits. It can be said that high-speed rail has revitalized China's grandeur!
China's informatization still needs to be accelerated. For example, can China further improve the educational conditions of primary and secondary schools? Using National People's Congress Affiliated High School, Tsinghua Affiliated High School, and Shanghai's good middle schools as platforms, and using all of China's good schools as platforms to open courses online. Can China's internet allow schools in border areas to use it for free? The country of the people is for the people. For example, for schools in the area west of the Hu Huanyong Line, the telecommunications network will be paid by the state and subsidies will be provided by the state; By opening up the curriculum of good high schools in Beijing and Shanghai, allowing high schools in Yunnan, Tibet, and Xinjiang to attend Beijing's classes, and allowing high schools in Guizhou to attend Shanghai's classes, our nation will have been revitalized in the past thirty to fifty years.
The people are better, the country is better. By improving the quality of education in the western region, some social problems have been solved. Education in ethnic minority areas is a major issue. If one educates the next generation well, many problems will be solved in a few generations.
If our country platformizes good secondary education, opens it up, and subsidizes it by the state, then students in the western region can receive better education. The flowers of your motherland are your children! What do parents earn money for? Parents earn money by raising children. The western region has developed, the economy has prospered, and the entire country has also made progress.
Liu Yadong: Mr. Ren has emphasized the importance of education on many occasions, and I fully agree with it. It can be said that the importance of education cannot be overemphasized. In terms of education itself, what is currently the most needed improvement in China?
Ren Zhengfei: What are you competing with the West for? It's impossible to rely on resources, we just need to revitalize culture and earn money back. Why is education important? Genius arises from youth. Primary and secondary schools have gone step by step, homogenizing education, and burying genius. Confucius always taught students according to their aptitude. Now some people say, don't learn English. Without learning English, rural children will always be farmers. How will you find employment in this world if you don't learn English? Some people say, don't learn mathematics. If you are not good at mathematics and English, you will not be able to enter high-end industries. Farmers' children will always be farmers, and class differentiation will occur. I understand that learning English in rural areas is difficult. But if you endure it, won't it come out? Perhaps the oral expression is not that good, but having the ability to recognize words is also good.
Ren Zhengfei: Huawei will become increasingly difficult and prosperous
Ren Zhengfei on the Importance of Learning English
We need to improve the treatment of teachers. Why do we have to engage in large-scale education? By dividing each class into small classes of 20 people, the teaching staff can be expanded by one to two times. Some people say that teachers cannot create value, but they can create the future. After twenty or thirty years, China will become stronger and we must find a way out, which will make it easier for children's education to be differentiated. By producing more talented children, we can create value.
So I believe that doing a good job in education requires differentiation; The second is that the country should use good schools as platforms, allowing them to become a website and bring the western region together. Now, our telecommunications have reached the countryside, but the internet is not in use. The network utilization rate in the eastern city of Hu Huanyong Line is very high, including in rural areas. However, the utilization rate of network optical fibers in the western region is so low. To improve the utilization rate and educate children well, what is not good for our country?
Liu Yadong: To develop education, in addition to hardware construction, software also needs to be updated. For example, attention should be paid to cultivating students' critical and questioning abilities, awakening their interest and curiosity.
Ren Zhengfei: Yes. If the internet is free for primary and secondary schools, why doesn't the computing power of artificial intelligence be free for college students? College students who are currently calculating online are actually mastering methods, which is to cultivate people who challenge the future for our country! How do you know that he is not a genius in the future? Creating a more open environment for college students, making them more active, can cultivate more talents and quirks.
Liu Yadong: In addition to education, President Ren has always emphasized the importance of basic research and should learn from the United States in this regard. What should we learn from the United States?
Ren Zhengfei: We still need to learn from the advanced culture of the United States. We have never said 'overthrow the United States'. Huawei is also conducting some basic research. Basic research cannot be separated from basic education. Basic education is the responsibility of the country, and without good basic education, top talents cannot be cultivated.
In the future, there will be fewer opportunities for us to recruit talents from abroad, which makes it even more necessary for China to cultivate talents on its own. Therefore, we need to change our teaching methods. Many famous Western schools do not have textbooks, such as MIT. The teacher came up to write a passage, another teacher came up to write a passage to criticize the previous one, and another teacher came up to criticize the previous one again. Afterwards, the students will do their own homework, and the teacher only needs to see that your ideas are correct and not make any conclusions. The teacher himself has no conclusion, what conclusion do you want? We need to learn from this educational model.
Therefore, we should learn from others' strengths and create national values. There is only one Steve Jobs in this world, do we have Steve Jobs in China? There should be some, many smart children are very powerful. The United States still has a lot of soil to attract talents, so we in China should also have this soil to attract high-level talents.
Liu Yadong: Many scientific research and cutting-edge exploration are "lonely long-distance races" with high levels of uncertainty. The work of these R&D personnel is extremely important, but often overlooked. How to solve this problem?
Ren Zhengfei: Our country should value those who cannot directly create value. People who cannot directly create value should also live a decent life. Without a decent life, no one will do it. It can only run behind the United States, as this country will never lead the world.
Northwestern Polytechnical University
